Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

It's a decision of the coder how he handles buffers. U-HE's Uhbiks need multiples of 16 for example.

252

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Yes, but additionally our hardware does not support any buffer size, only fixed ones (I think this is true for many pro audio cards). Usually that should be no problem as CoreAudio will take care of that.

Regards
Matthias Carstens
RME

253

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I can confirm that the FF400 works with 2009 Macbook white smile

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Mine works with a black Macbook that has a Lucent chipset...

... but only if the CPU load is below 50% (64- or 128-sample latency, 44100Hz)


I am studiying the problem currently. If I find a working solution (like http://www.lindy.de/ieee1394a-firewire- … 32908.html or http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products … veid=372), maybe I will post it here.


All the best
-j

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I did some tests on a Mac Mini (Lucent chipset) with a Fireface 800. This Mac (from my working place) has both Windows XP and OS X installed.

Again, on OS X you should stay below 50% of CPU load if you don't want any audio drop (64-sample latency, 44100Hz).

BUT on Windows, there is no problem using about 90% of CPU load. Moreover, the same audio process uses far less CPU on Windows than on OS X.


Then, I tried to use the built-in sound card on OS X. Still at 64 samples of latency, the maximum possible CPU was only 60%.


For me, the problem is solved: no more CPU-consumming audio on OS X.


Best regards,
-j

256

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

This may be be a help to those looking at buying a new Mac.
I have the latest Imac 20"  2.66 with 4 Gig Ram Lucent 5901 FW chip, I than have a FF800 connected thru a LaCei D2 Harddrive all with fw800 cables and all working perfectly . Haven't pushed it to the limit yet but all good so far !

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Nuff wrote:

This may be be a help to those looking at buying a new Mac.
I have the latest Imac 20"  2.66 with 4 Gig Ram Lucent 5901 FW chip, I than have a FF800 connected thru a LaCei D2 Harddrive all with fw800 cables and all working perfectly . Haven't pushed it to the limit yet but all good so far !

Well, according to the statement above, it's when you go beyond 50% load with low latency the problem starts. It would be nice if you could report your results as well. If not the same, it would be interesting to find out what?s causing the different results.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

On the Mac Book Pro 17'' (late 2008) the problem with the FW800 port and FF800 was solved with a firewire cable 800 to 400.
Everything works perfect! Just connect to the Mac ff port and to ff800 firwire 400 port. No problems!

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

drivebass wrote:

On the Mac Book Pro 17'' (late 2008) the problem with the FW800 port and FF800 was solved with a firewire cable 800 to 400.
Everything works perfect! Just connect to the Mac ff port and to ff800 firwire 400 port. No problems!

And how about low latency (e.g. 48 samples) above 50-60% load?

260

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

This post descibes how to determine your firewire chipset: http://www.rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4986

It also mentiones which chipset revision should work fine (7). But, how can I check the chipset revision, ' cause it's not shown via the above mentioned method.

Any thoughts?

261 (edited by Gavin 2009-04-17 19:33:17)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

julien breval wrote:

I did some tests on a Mac Mini (Lucent chipset) with a Fireface 800. This Mac (from my working place) has both Windows XP and OS X installed.

Again, on OS X you should stay below 50% of CPU load if you don't want any audio drop (64-sample latency, 44100Hz).

BUT on Windows, there is no problem using about 90% of CPU load. Moreover, the same audio process uses far less CPU on Windows than on OS X.


Then, I tried to use the built-in sound card on OS X. Still at 64 samples of latency, the maximum possible CPU was only 60%.


For me, the problem is solved: no more CPU-consumming audio on OS X.


Best regards,
-j

I just did some tests to on a Mac Mini with a fireface 800. It also has the lucent chipset. And, above 50% CPU load Cubase starts complaining.

I took about 8 tracks audio, filled the inserts up with compressors, limiters and reverbs and on 64-sample the sound is a complete mess. Cubase complains about CPU while the CPU usage is about 130% (for 2 cores).

In addition I switched to the Mac's internal audio output and everything works smooth. I can push the limits to a 175% CPU usage.

Is this the issue we're talking about?

Should this be solved with an alternative firewire hub?

262

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Okay, check this out. I just stopped by my friendly local mac store here across the bay from San Francisco. I checked out 3 different macs, the new 15" 2.66 pro, the 17" pro, and the white macbook. I opened the console utility app, filtered on "firewire", and saw the damndest thing. The first entry was dated January 26 and said
Firewire (OHCI) TI ID 8025.....

Wow!

But then I saw a whole bunch entries dated later that said

Firewire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901

just like my latebook.


I wonder if the original OSX driver had a bug and mis-identified itself and later it was fixed? But all three macs had this.

Meaningless?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Hi,

you mean when doing a search in "Console.app" filter "firewire" in new Mac's
you get TI, and Lucent Firewire at the same time ? doesn't make sense to me !
is this with OSX 10.5.6 or later version ?

regards S-EH

264

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

S-E Hansson wrote:

Hi,

you mean when doing a search in "Console.app" filter "firewire" in new Mac's
you get TI, and Lucent Firewire at the same time ? doesn't make sense to me !
is this with OSX 10.5.6 or later version ?

regards S-EH

Yes. But only that early date of Jan 26.
Tell me about it. Doesn't make sense to me either, but that's what I saw.
I didn't think to look at the version of OSX, but isn't the latest  10.5.6?

It's probably meaningless.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Hi,

yes OSX 10.5.6 should be the latest

regards S-EH

266 (edited by flextone 2009-05-29 15:22:31)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Do late 08 alu (non unibody) MBP's use the TI chipset? together with the matte screen they are starting to look like a better deal than a new MBP.  Still no news on Rev7 from LSI?

267

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Just looked at a white macbook at bestbuy. The agere chip version was 5903 instead of 5901 for the macbook pro. Could this be the much anticipated newer revision?

268

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I thought the 5903 is FW400 and the 5901 is FW800
Could be wrong ?

269

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Nuff wrote:

I thought the 5903 is FW400 and the 5901 is FW800
Could be wrong ?

makes sense.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Randy wrote:

Just looked at a white macbook at bestbuy. The agere chip version was 5903 instead of 5901 for the macbook pro. Could this be the much anticipated newer revision?

Possibly - at least I've had reports of things working without repeater cable with the following chip info:

FireWire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901 built-in now active, GUID 00254bfffea7d2de; max speed s800.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

271

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

RME Support wrote:
Randy wrote:

Just looked at a white macbook at bestbuy. The agere chip version was 5903 instead of 5901 for the macbook pro. Could this be the much anticipated newer revision?

Possibly - at least I've had reports of things working without repeater cable with the following chip info:

FireWire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901 built-in now active, GUID 00254bfffea7d2de; max speed s800.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

I'm not osx knowledgeable enough, but I think the GUID is a globally unique identifier (thus the name. doh!) that unique for each machine . However, I think part of the GUID is based on the chip. So I just came back from my friendly, oh so hip mac store with some GUIDs for a range of macbooks. Here they are

white macbook
00254bfffebb2a22. (Lucent ID 5903 GUID ......  max speed s400 )

The macbook pros were all Lucent ID 5901 GUID ..... max speed s800

2 15 " 2.4 GHZ macbook pros
002332fffeb91aca
002332fffeba4ad6

17" macbook pro
0023dffffead39ba

15" 2.66 macbook pro
0023dffffeabd9a2

My own 15" 2.53 macbook pro uses the
002332fffe style numbering.


So waddaya think about that?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I had my friend come over last night with his Macbook Black 2.4ghz - Tested to see what chipset he was running, it was the Lucent 5811 - i instantly thought that this wouldnt work at all, to my supprise, loaded up my FF400 - bus powered - was able to run mp3's through iTunes without a single jerk/drop out/glitch, loaded up ableton, ran multiple tracks at once without a single glitch or drop out too..

Has anyone had similar experience with the Lucent 5811? Is there anymore tests i can run to see if it really can handle it as good as it was ?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

biggiesmalls wrote:

loaded up ableton, ran multiple tracks at once without a single glitch or drop out too..

Has anyone had similar experience with the Lucent 5811? Is there anymore tests i can run to see if it really can handle it as good as it was ?

With 32 samples buffer size?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Gavin wrote:

This post descibes how to determine your firewire chipset: http://www.rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4986

It also mentiones which chipset revision should work fine (7). But, how can I check the chipset revision, ' cause it's not shown via the above mentioned method.

Any thoughts?

I just bought the latest MacBook Pro 15" (June 2009) and it also has the Lucent FW controller. Would be interesting to know the revision though, but I've not been able to find it anywhere, too...

Could anyone please answer Gavin's question? Maybe Admin Knut, the author of the aforementioned post? Would be really appreciated! :-)

Thx in adv,
Mike

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Sorry for small hijack.
Since we know that latest 13" MBP FW (June 2009) works fine with FF devices, I'd like to ask if FF400 can work without adapter?
Can anyone try / test if it works fine only buss powered on battery?

Thanks,

      b.

--
Bostjan Pirnar
www.minimal.si

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

first post here! .. would basically like to know how to find out the revision number on my MBP firewire chip (april 2009 upgrade, the latest 15" with expresscard) ... any suggestions? since i'm choosing between an mh2882 and ff800 this is potentially a dealbreaker ..

277 (edited by myand 2009-07-12 21:33:56)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Hi,

First of all I do not really know where to post this, so don?t hesitate to put it somewhere else.

I am a happy RME FF 400 user. I just got a question for my own understanding.
I am not concerned by any problems posted in this thread or by problems with Agere Chipsets etc. So I never thought about checking my Macbook for the Chipset. Because everything runs smooth I thought I have a TI controller in my MacBook 2,1 (late 2006, 2ghz C2D). As fas as I know TI controllers are "the good" controllers. Today I checked out of interest what controller my MacBook has. And surprise: When I start my Macbook in single user mode it states: Firewire Lucent ID 5811. Well I just wonder why I got no problem with Audio via Firewire even though it is no TI controller. Obviously only some non TI controller don?t work well with Audio via Firewire which makes this whole thing even more confusing....

I?d be happy if someone could explain to me this "issue"

best regards

myand

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Does the issue with the Firewire chipset and FF800 in Macbook Pro's still exist with the new models that were just released in June 2009?  The reason I ask, is because the new MBP 15" lacks an ExpressCard slot for the workaround mentioned here.  Thanks.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I have problems with macbookpro 2,8ghz (late2009) 10.5.8, ff800 with fw 800 connection lucent chip, the host light is blinking every 5th second and looses connection....
New cable,updated driver 2.63 ,two ad/da 8 conververters adat inputs and wordclock sync for those....
SO what to do....? Running cubase 5,1 , keeps on crashin`
:-O

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Macbook Pro 15" mid 2009 works with the Fireface 400. No idea about the FF800 though.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

ok, i've been waiting for months now, could you please answer this:

how do I find out the revision number on my MBP firewire chip?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Try this: http://rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4986
For more details, you may need to ask Apple.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

top1001 wrote:

I have problems with macbookpro 2,8ghz (late2009) 10.5.8, ff800 with fw 800 connection lucent chip, the host light is blinking every 5th second and looses connection....
New cable,updated driver 2.63 ,two ad/da 8 conververters adat inputs and wordclock sync for those....
SO what to do....? Running cubase 5,1 , keeps on crashin`
:-O

ive got the same flashing Host light problem.

Gutted... whats the cheapest work around then? OR do i need to sell it on...

284 (edited by Kraymon 2009-10-10 19:14:02)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I've just tried it through my firewire HD and it does indeed work.

Still frustrating though because I bought the laptop and fireface 400  to be portable and now i have to carry around my HD (with important data on) to gigs... i wondering what the cheapest hub / wire option would be?  I heard about that repeater cable but i don't want to buy one without being sure it will work. Can anyone offer any options? Has anyone tried these wires?

edit: i just read somewhere that the Hard Drive doesnt need to be switched on or mounted and it still works!! crazy.  So surely that means i can find a cable that will solve the problem...??

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

RME Support wrote:

Try this: http://rme-audio.de/forum/viewtopic.php?id=4986
For more details, you may need to ask Apple.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

got this: FireWire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901 built-in now active, GUID 0023dffffea214e0; max speed s800.

is this revision 6 or 7?

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Here's how to identify the revision of the LSI/Agere chipset:

In Terminal type:  ioreg -lxw0
(lower case "L" and digit Zero)

find in FRWR:


FRWR@0  <class IOPCIDevice, id 0x1000001d8, registered, matched, active, busy 0 (695 ms), retain 9>
    | |   |     | {
    | |   |     |   "assigned-addresses" = <1000048200000000000010d30000000000100000>
    | |   |     |   "IOInterruptSpecifiers" = (<1300000007000000>,<1900000000000100>)
    | |   |     |   "fwswappedbib" = <01000000>
    | |   |     |   "class-code" = <10000c00>
    | |   |     |   "IODeviceMemory" = (({"address"=0xffffffffd3100000,"length"=0x1000}))
    | |   |     |   "fwtune" = <00000008e3e3040000000808e3e3144100004008200b40bf0000700810000000>
    | |   |     |   "pci-aspm-supported" = Yes
    | |   |     |   "IOPowerManagement" = {"ChildrenPowerState"=0x2,"CurrentPowerState"=0x2}
    | |   |     |   "subsystem-vendor-id" = <c1110000>
    | |   |     |   "built-in" = <00>
    | |   |     |   "acpi-device" = "IOACPIPlatformDevice is not serializable"
    | |   |     |   "IOPCIMSIMode" = Yes
    | |   |     |   "IOInterruptControllers" = ("io-apic-0","IOPCIMessagedInterruptController")
    | |   |     |   "name" = "pci11c1,5901"
    | |   |     |   "IOChildIndex" = 0x1
    | |   |     |   "device-id" = <01590000>
    | |   |     |   "vendor-id" = <c1110000>
    | |   |     |   "IOPCIExpressASPMDefault" = 0x0
    | |   |     |   "fws0" = <01000000>
    | |   |     |   "compatible" = <706369313163312c3539303000706369313163312c3539303100706369636c6173732c30633030313000>
    | |   |     |   "acpi-pmcap-offset" = 0x44
    | |   |     |   "IOPCIExpressLinkCapabilities" = 0x73c11
    | |   |     |   "IOPCIResourced" = Yes
    | |   |     |   "acpi-path" = "IOACPIPlane:/_SB/PCI0@0/RP05@160000/FRWR@0"
    | |   |     |   "subsystem-id" = <00590000>
    | |   |     |   "revision-id" = <07000000>
    | |   |     |   "IOPCIExpressLinkStatus" = 0x1011
    | |   |     |   "IOName" = "pci11c1,5901"
    | |   |     |   "fwports" = <01000000>
    | |   |     |   "reg" = <0000040000000000000000000000000000000000100004020000000000000000000000


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Randy wrote:

Okay, check this out. I just stopped by my friendly local mac store here across the bay from San Francisco. I checked out 3 different macs, the new 15" 2.66 pro, the 17" pro, and the white macbook. I opened the console utility app, filtered on "firewire", and saw the damndest thing. The first entry was dated January 26 and said
Firewire (OHCI) TI ID 8025.....

Wow!

But then I saw a whole bunch entries dated later that said

Firewire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901

just like my latebook.


I wonder if the original OSX driver had a bug and mis-identified itself and later it was fixed? But all three macs had this.

Meaningless?

Easy explanation.

The MAC you saw this on, TI first, then Lucent.
It's remains in the log from the MAC the image was built on.

I've tested it myself.
Clone my MAC pro image over to the MBP.
TI in the log from MAC pro, Lucent on the MBP.

And for people searching in the console after firewire, search the kernel.log, muc faster and safer.

P

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

I just use FW400 anyway and plug a HD on my FW800 port. I heard it's just better that way.

Andre

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Could somebody answer on kraymon`s question.... (also asked by me) hub or firewirecard? or working solution for lucent chip set.....:-O

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

i confirm that the Ff400 doesn't work properly (only Midi works sometimes) on a MBP Late 2008 (Lucent Chip Rev 6)

about this repaetercable i heard from a friend that it crashed his harddisks 2 times on an iMac (early 2009) - luckily this repeatercable was recommend by the apple-service so it was a guarantee - the guy now uses a Mac Pro

actually i'm really pissed by apple - i bought exactly this MBP to have Firewire and the oppertunity to use my Ff400 - and it doesn't work

also i wonder if other Firewire-Interface work with this MBP?

291

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

i confirm that the Ff400 doesn't work properly (only Midi works sometimes) on a MBP Late 2008 (Lucent Chip Rev 6)

Yes, this unfortunately true. Apple changed the FW chipset with the mid 2009 series to the working revision 7. As far as we know a FW repeater like the Lindy cable or an external HD with FW hub will be a perfect working solution for older Macbooks with revision 6 chips.

best regards
Knut

292 (edited by flou242 2009-11-17 14:29:09)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Hi,

I read and read the forum through, but couldn't find any suitable answer :

Does the FF800 work on the agere chip revision 6 (MBP unibody late 2008) ?  Or do i still need a repeater / hub ?

Thanks for the anwer.

Greets.

Pierre

293 (edited by kontraform 2009-11-18 00:35:35)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

flou242 wrote:

Hi,
Does the FF800 work on the agere chip revision 6 (MBP unibody late 2008) ?  Or do i still need a repeater / hub ?

Pierre

I'd lite to extend that question to review all chipsets ... are there any known issues with FW-chipsets on any reasonably new Macbooks and Pros?

294

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Rev 6 Agere/LSI needs a hub or repeater, rev 7 does not. The new Macbook Pros and iMacs have the rev 7.

Regards,
Jeff Petersen
Synthax Inc.

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

So 5901 lucent in mid 2009 mbp 17" 2,8 works with .....? Cubase 5,1 crashin?and ff800 blinkin?like a christmas tree.... so anybody has a solution ...... hub , express card 800 , 400-800 cable or just sell it.........:rollrant

296

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Please contact the support. From your brief description I don?t think it?s a chipset problem.

best regards
Knut

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

do you think this one would do the trick? its a bit cheaper than the lindy cable...
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Max-Value-Firew … pd_cp_ce_1

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Should do, but it may depend on the chip being used inside the cable. You have to try yourself.

299 (edited by urknall 2009-11-30 15:07:55)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Hi!

To go mobile and preparing for a gig, i decided to borrow out a white mac book from my girlfriend.

As it seems i am in bad luck, since i identified the chipset as Lucent ID 5811. Just testing out how stable
it is, but i had already some crackles at low latency. Maybe i am a bit too low, since normally i only use
my mac pro wink

Edit: When i drive the fireface bus powered the host led is on and its not working, when i use power supply
i can work with it....

Anyone has experience with the chipset i have (running fireface 400)?

Lindy firewire cable should do the trick i guess, anyone knows how to get in in germany or a cheaper
version of another manufacture that is working properly?

What latencies should i be able to run with a white mac book 2,2 ghz?

Greets Urknall

Mac Pro Early 2008 2,8 Octo 10 GB RAM, OSX 10.7.4, FF 400 (v3.08 / 1.71)

Re: Hardware Alert: FireWire solutions with Agere FW chip

Instead of the Lindy cable (Lindy is a german company sitting in Mannheim, try www.lindy.de wink) you can try just any other Firewire device that works on the Lucent and daisy chain the Fireface (like a harddrive, a hub or even a MOTU Ultralite).