Topic: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

Ok guys, now i need some help with this one.
I have 2 Multiface I's and one Multiface II.
The HDSP cards are two rev.1.9's and one 1.4.
When I install everything the numbering/the order of the cards seem to be totally accidental.
I can put them one by one or whatever still the one with 1.4 card becomes always the card 1.
The thing is i'd like to have the MFII as my card1.
Other than that everything works faultlessly.
What can I do?

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

Windows decides... You could try exchanging the order of the PCI cards in the slots.
Also, if you provide external power supply, you could just run the MF II with the 1.4 card.

Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

3 (edited by undertone 2011-09-13 19:07:26)

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

I've always wondered about this. I had to re-arrange the way I wanted to work with my cards based on the way they were enumerated. No matter what I tried I couldn't change the enumeration, including slot swapping. It always strikes me as a step in the wrong direction when we end up adapting to the machine instead of the other way round.

PC1 = HDSPe PCIe: DF-ADI-8 DS / HDSPe PCIe: MF2
MBP = HDSPe Expresscard: MF1

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

same here.... i have a PCIe (1.3 if i'm not wrong) and a PCI (1.5) and the multiface connected to the PCI is number one.
I had to reorganize live's preferences and the patchaby (this was the less funny bit, since I have 4 patchbays and things are very very cluttered) but i was even less willing to open up the computer and try some card swaps than reconnect some cables in the patchbay.
I tried to have two multifaces II working together with just one PCIe card and I couldn't get them to work, i got a PCI card for cheap and now I'm happy... 20 outs and 16 ins are nice, since I have a large desk with a very nice sound, so I can finally mix on the desk and not just route busses on 8 channels.

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

The ultimate question is how Windows decides. I'm not convinced the RME drivers are innocent in this since card swapping on my computer didn't change anything. Then again, it could be that Windows is too stupid and stubborn and sticks to whatever setup was done initially.

Time will tell, unless all this stuff becomes obsolete by the time the culprit is found. Maybe Paul Allen can help... DeadHorse

PC1 = HDSPe PCIe: DF-ADI-8 DS / HDSPe PCIe: MF2
MBP = HDSPe Expresscard: MF1

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

We already had something similar in another thread. This behavior becomes a problem for Pro Tools Native users, because of the 32 channels limit.

I had a look at the Registry and found that Windows seems to stick a *random* but *permanent* number to every audio input/output ever present in the system. The problem is that in the Registry these audio ports are then sorted alphabetically by *key* name aka by ascending *random* numbers. This leads to all ports being shuffled around each other without any particular order.

It's the job of the audio software to sort the ports in a useful manner and there even is another location in the Registry that does the sorting alphabetically by *port* name. Media Player Classic is one software that makes use of that specific Registry sorting and thus offers a far more usable list.

One could try to see what happens when the numbering of the Registry keys is changed manually.

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

Timur: I don't think we're talking about the same thing. The port shuffling is not the issue here. It's that when there are multiple RME cards in the same system, TM and the RME driver numbers the cards "1" and "2", etc... for no logical reason. This order cannot be changed. RME claims it's Windows. I don't even know if Microsoft is aware of the issue. Foggedaboudit.

PC1 = HDSPe PCIe: DF-ADI-8 DS / HDSPe PCIe: MF2
MBP = HDSPe Expresscard: MF1

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

Ok, guys. I went through all possible variations and no change. Changes pci slots etc....the numbering stayed the same all the time. Although i had two rev.1.9 cards in and they were numbered 1 & 2, always when installing the 1.4 card it became nr.1.

So, in the end i just decided to use MFII with 1.4.

One funny thing is that MFI's have some weird noise in the unbalanced headphone/line out channels. Its linked to graphical activity. I was thinking it has something to do with having too little power....and yes, It disappears completely with ext. PSU!!! So, i decided to use ext PSU on all MF's and it makes the noise floor slightly better on all channels which is no wonder as there is 1A power and the audio in the same cable. Very recommended.

I also use word clock to sync them although i'm not completely sury if it is necessary as there reads that cards nr. 2 & 3 get their time code from card 1.?!

With 3x MF with word clock and ext. PSU's this setup is amazinly good sounding 30 analog out/ 24 analog in setup.

Actually I assume that the numbering problem is because once Windows has decided the order of the cards it stays the same no matter what. So to fix this i'm guessing that registry might be the target....

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

Just a small comment: There is no general problem of higher noise floor or so when using busl power... Neither with the Multifaces nor with the FF400.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

10 (edited by Telefunk 2011-09-14 23:40:23)

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

RME Support wrote:

Just a small comment: There is no general problem of higher noise floor or so when using busl power... Neither with the Multifaces nor with the FF400.


Regards
Daniel Fuchs
RME

I dont know if it's general or not but i'm definitely not the only one with this problem...and the solution of ext PSU works perfectly.

I'd say it's because you have 1A power and audio too close... or just too weak current/bad grounding. Only comes to suface with unbalanced line out/headphone.

Re: Multiple Multifaces. How to know which becomes card 1???????

I realise this as an old thread but I came across it while trying to fix the same multiface ordering problem.
Im guessing since this thread was created a feature fix was implemented and now the Multiface order can be adjusted, hurrah!

Open up the Hammerfall DSP Settings
Go the the Global Tab
Us the Up and Down buttons to change the order of your devices and click Apply.

(fyi Im using 2 Multifaces with a PCIe and a Cardbus in an adaper and all works well)