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RME User Forum → FireWire & USB series → What's the verdict on current Macbook Pros + USB RME interfaces?
This is the link:
https://www.caldigit.com/thunderbolt-3/ … splayPort/
Following it I don't understand your problem. Even me as a drummer can easily see that there are just two docks presented.
Regarding the problems - they are the same in all Mac 2018 computers.
That link is useless as it points to no specific product. And the products presented there are as far as I see USB-C to USB solutions, not Thunderbolt to USB.
Whoops, I pasted the wrong link. I edited the post now, but here is the one I have:
https://www.hypershop.com/collections/u … k-air-2018
It appears to meet the 40 GB/s, 60Hz, and Thunderbolt flash icon criteria.
Regarding the problems - they are the same in all Mac 2018 computers.
See, this is the problem with having the only statement from RME being posts across so many threads. The post linked doesn't say that it works for all 2018 Macs. I too am a drummer and I "can easily see" that that post refers to the 2018 Mac Mini. It's in a thread about the Mac Mini, and specifically says the problems being discussed are about the 2018 Mac Mini.
The fact that you expect users to read hundreds of posts, and then cross reference them to understand what's going on and how to resolve it is terrible.
The lack of compassion and understanding for frustrated users isn't great either.
Whoops, I pasted the wrong link. I edited the post now, but here is the one I have:
https://www.hypershop.com/collections/u … k-air-2018
It appears to meet the 40 GB/s, 60Hz, and Thunderbolt flash icon criteria.
As far as I see here it appears to meet the 'no Thunderbolt to USB conversion' criteria.
rodrigo.constanzo wrote:Whoops, I pasted the wrong link. I edited the post now, but here is the one I have:
https://www.hypershop.com/collections/u … k-air-2018
It appears to meet the 40 GB/s, 60Hz, and Thunderbolt flash icon criteria.
As far as I see here it appears to meet the 'no Thunderbolt to USB conversion' criteria.
As in, it (theoretically) should work? Or it won't work.
Last two pages of this thread kind of proves the need of a proper sticky or a statement describing problem, current state and workarounds, it must feel a bit counterproductive to keep anwering to people one by one finding out their new mac won't work with usb interfaces, people don't read through hundreds of forum posts and they shouldn't. Getting sued by apple delusion not good enough (and so far only) excuse for not doing this.
Getting sued by apple delusion not good enough (and so far only) excuse for not doing this.
If RME really know what the problem is then sticking to the technical facts about the causes and remedies in a statement about it should not cause any legal action - that's just my opinion of course. Let Apple explain why it is incorrect and amend the statement if required in light of their answer - or disclose their answer. Talking about transparency here.
On a side note, regarding having to use use a thunderbolt hub - I'm not sure if I'd call that a workaround or a fix. Frankly you can't connect a USB device to a USB-C port without a hub anyway - that it needs to a be certain type of hub is half workaround and half fix in my opinion.
On a side note, regarding having to use use a thunderbolt hub - I'm not sure if I'd call that a workaround or a fix. Frankly you can't connect a USB device to a USB-C port without a hub anyway - that it needs to a be certain type of hub is half workaround and half fix in my opinion.
That's not exactly accurate. I bought a whole bunch of USB-C to USB-A cables when I first got my 2017 machine to use instead of having to deal with dongles. Up to this point this has all worked really well.
That's not exactly accurate. I bought a whole bunch of USB-C to USB-A cables when I first got my 2017 machine to use instead of having to deal with dongles. Up to this point this has all worked really well.
Well I did say half.
rodrigo.constanzo wrote:That's not exactly accurate. I bought a whole bunch of USB-C to USB-A cables when I first got my 2017 machine to use instead of having to deal with dongles. Up to this point this has all worked really well.
Well I did say half.
Hey Astro,
Regarding the Hub and buying it in Australia, I believe this will work http://shop.caldigit.com/asia/index.php … uct_id=176
It's in USD still but looks like you'll be able to put in an Australian address.
Cheers,
L
Hey Astro,
Regarding the Hub and buying it in Australia, I believe this will work http://shop.caldigit.com/asia/index.php … uct_id=176
It's in USD still but looks like you'll be able to put in an Australian address.
Cheers,
L
Thanks - but I'm not Asian and given the choice between buying from an Australian vendor who has physical a presence in Melbourne and happens to also sell via eBay and buying out of Asia - I know where I'll be buying from.
I'm not sure why the RME moderator here has an aversion to eBay as a selling channel - I shouldn't have to feel guilty buying via eBay, Also I'm not sure why some companies think it's adequate to have an Asian head office for Australian sales - or why some Europeans and Americans think we are in the Asian region - we are nowhere near Asia. I'm in Sydney - it's thousands of miles away to Asia and they are foreigners. :-)
Also eBay has a lot of buyer protection that I bet I wouldn't get buying direct from a foreign country.
I'm not sure why the RME moderator here has an aversion to eBay as a selling channel - I shouldn't have to feel guilty buying via eBay,
I think you may have misunderstood MC’s last comment — he probably doesn’t have time to verify product details on other websites, that’s our job! If you’ve found the Caldigit I say go for it and sell it on when Apple fix USB audio...
newest mojave update did not fix it. hillarious.
I'm picking up my new (replacement) machine today, so will give it a test, but in speaking to a friend he recently tested a few variations with a shit (focusrite) USB sound card:
so, today i was able to test 2018 13" macbook pro with a lovely new usb-c to usb-b cable and a horrid focusrite scarlet 2/4 usb-2 interface.
it is good and bad news. good, interface seems to work. bad, causes macbook pro fans to kick in and stay kicked in constantly at high rate. very loud and very hot.
using through a crappy passive thunderbolt 3 hub, everything works perfectly.
I hadn't heard anyone mention the fan spinning up badly, so that's new to me.
to keep things interessting. the 2018 macbook pro is running hot
to keep things interessting. the 2018 macbook pro is running hot
If that was the only problem, I'd be happy. Unfortunately, Apple has seen a way to make screen to mainboard cables even crappier. And if that flatcable fails, you need to replace the entire LCD assembly, as there is no connector and no way to unsolder it.
Besides, even the problems with the keyboards haven't been fixed either.
I've been a Mac user since 1989, but I doubt heavily that my next laptop will be from Apple. Maybe a Mini. With a Linux laptop next to it. If RME would provide drivers and software for Linux/BSD, I'd have jumped ship already.
In a way, Apple should be glad RME doesn't provide Linux drivers... 
creepels wrote:to keep things interessting. the 2018 macbook pro is running hot
If that was the only problem, I'd be happy. Unfortunately, Apple has seen a way to make screen to mainboard cables even crappier. And if that flatcable fails, you need to replace the entire LCD assembly, as there is no connector and no way to unsolder it.
Besides, even the problems with the keyboards haven't been fixed either.
I've been a Mac user since 1989, but I doubt heavily that my next laptop will be from Apple. Maybe a Mini. With a Linux laptop next to it. If RME would provide drivers and software for Linux/BSD, I'd have jumped ship already.
In a way, Apple should be glad RME doesn't provide Linux drivers...
List goes on as well for me. xcode is crap for a long time, safari can´t handle video well, the touchbar hangs from time to time, and and and. maybe we are so heavily pissed because it really feels dumb as fuck if you pay for the extra bit of getting a macbook, which is suposed to "just work" when in fact those metal junk got ever more expensive and increasingly broke as fuck. Thinking that this was the last mac for me too. Sadly right now I am considering an Interface change. really cant buy a TB3 Dongle for 150€ just to have a working usb when the is the UAD Arrow for about 500€. Not as good as my Babyface Pro, but nevertheless.
We gave a link to the docks and there are only two of them. Both work.
I received the CalDigit HDMI Mini Dock. This version of the Caldigit h/w has two HDMI Ports, a USB 3.0 port, a USB 2.0 Port, and an ethernet port. Obviously we are interested in the two USB ports here.
I tested the Babyface Pro with the USB 3.0 port and it seemed to record fine in Logic Pro.
The USB 2.0 did not power the Babyface Pro unit at all - none of the LEDs lit up on the unit to indicate it had powered up (even momentarily) and it made static noises through my amplifiers loudspeaker which was taking a feed from the headphone out on the BFP into an aux-in on my Amp.
I then tested the USB 2.0 port with a USB mouse, my iPhone X and a USB 2.0 externally powered Hard Drive. All of which worked on the USB 2.0 port.
My theory is that the USB 2.0 port on the Caldigit dock may only deliver the bare minimum USB 2.0 current which is 500 mA via its USB 2.0 port - per the USB 2.0 specifications. However that's just my theory and I would like to confirm that.
Obviously from reading the specifications of the Babyface Pro it requires more current than the USB 2.0 specification which is probably fine for a PC but I wonder about this particular USB 2.0 port on the mini dock because they are probably pushing the boundaries of the USB-C port's power supply with the other ports available on the mini dock and may have restricted the available current on USB 2.0 to comply with the specifications - thereby keeping total current on all ports within the boundaries of what a USB-C port can supply.
Thoughts from RME on this?
I have contacted Caldigit support and will see what I can find out from them.
Just to add to the above post.
I have just tested the Caldigit HDMI mini hub using the USB 2.0 however I had to use an external power supply for the Babyface Pro to get it to work. I had a 12V 2.5A centre positive DC power supply from a Netgear Router that seems to work. Hopefully it doesn't matter that it's 2.5A ie. hopefully that's not too much power. I assume the BFP only draws what it requires?
So either the mini hub doesn't supply enough current by design or it is a defective unit. I will try and confirm with Caldigit as mentioned above.
Just to add to the above post.
I have just tested the Caldigit HDMI mini hub using the USB 2.0 however I had to use an external power supply for the Babyface Pro to get it to work. I had a 12V 2.5A centre positive DC power supply from a Netgear Router that seems to work. Hopefully it doesn't matter that it's 2.5A ie. hopefully that's not too much power. I assume the BFP only draws what it requires?
So either the mini hub doesn't supply enough current by design or it is a defective unit. I will try and confirm with Caldigit as mentioned above.
Our MADIface Pro also doesn’t power up via the Caldigit usb 2 port. I haven’t tried the usb 3 port.
I’m more concerned by the glitch we picked up yesterday as reported in one of the other threads.
21 channels at 44.1k into a 2018 MBP running Reaper on 10.14.3 with a sample size of 1024 and it still glitched. Perf meter showed <6% cpu usage.
Are there any other OSX settings I need to check to ensure smooth performance? WiFi was switched off. Or is this related to the 802 buffering issues MC was looking to fix in 3.15?
This is really disappointing after spending £135 on a hub...
Low CPU load can be a problem on Macbooks, because of their rather aggressive power saving features. Try to create artificial CPU load to see if the glitches get better.
soo...reconsidered. Purchased the Caldigit TS3 Plus. Just like my Babyface Pro too much. UAD Stuff seems ok, but somehow like Plugin selling Machines.
At least the Mac can be charged with that Doc, I´ll give an update on how things will work out for me.
Are there any other OSX settings I need to check to ensure smooth performance? WiFi was switched off. Or is this related to the 802 buffering issues MC was looking to fix in 3.15?
Current version is here:
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/dr … 5_b1_3.zip
I got this reply from Caldigit this morning just for everyone's information:
Thanks for contacting us over the phone yesterday. Unfortunately, our mini Dock USB 2.0 port only produces 500mA (in line with USB 2.0 guidelines) and therefore cannot fully power your Babyface Pro device. I would encourage you to use the USB 3.0 port that is also connected to the mini Dock for this purpose.
So I guess at least their unit isn't defective - it's by design. It's actually the BFP that doesn't fully comply with the USB2 specifications. No big deal there is a USB 3.0 port and I'll just use the USB 2.0 port for lower powered devices. I sometimes used to record with the BFP on my old MacBook using one USB port and the other would keep my phone charged and taking a video on a stand.
Not had a chance to test this with my RME yet, but currently on a gig with my USB MOTU (Microbook II) and after an hour or so of having the audio running, all I get is a loud digital noise on my input (and subsequently output) regardless of what's going in.
I had to physically unplug the soundcard to get it running again.
Not promising or good...
So I guess at least their unit isn't defective - it's by design. It's actually the BFP that doesn't fully comply with the USB2 specifications.
When the USB 2 specs were still up, the spec read "minimum 500 mA".
If the connected device draws more current, it needs it's own power supply.
In general, most laptop ports don't provide more than 500 mA, but some desktops do. The one that keeps lingering on in my mind, is Apple's G4 Cube, that provided 2200 mA, because Apple's external audio interface needed it. That interface doesn't work with any other computer, as there's no connector for external power. It is, however, Audio class compliant.
Some harddisk manufacturer's sidestepped that problem by providing a Y-cable, drawing power from 2 USB ports.
The USB 2 specs have been taken down and replaced by the USB 3 specs. And those are an entirely different kind of animal. They're so vague on several points, that Microsoft first decided not to include an Audio class driver in Windows 10.
When the USB 2 specs were still up, the spec read "minimum 500 mA".
http://www.rme-audio.de/en/products/babyface_pro.php
Under the general specifications in the above link it says 600mA - not disputing that at some point in time they may have said 500mA.
It seems that this issue is finally getting some attention:
https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/02 … face-users
It seems that this issue is finally getting some attention:
https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/02 … face-users
Great find. We’ve retweeted them and hope others do the same: https://twitter.com/appleinsider/status … 00257?s=21
My only concern is the discrepancies between reports eg the article says Thunderbolt audio is also affected but RME say it’s fine.
I imagine Apple will dismiss these sorts of problems more readily...
We just bought Caldigit Thunderbolt3 Mini dock (with 2 HDMI) and hoped we finally could work with MBP 2018 and MADIface USB on live shows in our theatre, after 8 months of HELL!
So, bad news guys for all pro audio community:
MADIface USB DOSEN'T WORK with Caldigit mini hub AT ALL!!!!!
It connects, shows Totalmix and RME settings, so far you could think all is good, but when you try to play some audio file in MacOS preview, Qlab, Wavelab or other app, the playback doesnt start: playing time doesnt run, there is no sound and no indication on Totalmix channels!!!
We have 2 MBPs - both has such result, High Sierra or Mojave - doesnt matter. Firmware - 24. Drivers tried- 3.14, 3.15, 3.15b1 - all the same story.
External USB drives, ethernet connections work fine with this dock, MADIface USB - is recognized, but doesnt work (tried both USB2 and USB3 ports)!
So, now we can work only 2 ways with MBP 2018 + RME MADIface USB:
1) on MacOS: using only internal minijack output (2 channels);
2) on Windows (Bootcamp): with buggy SCS (Show Cue Systems) software (using all RME interface outputs with no problems).
We need working chain of MBP+RME+Qlab!!!!!
Apple, please DO SOMETHING FINALLY! We are waiting 8(!!!) months for now!!!! The audio Pros cant work with your actual "Pro" machines!!!
We just bought Caldigit Thunderbolt3 Mini dock (with 2 HDMI) and hoped we finally could work with MBP 2018 and MADIface USB on live shows in our theatre, after 8 months of HELL!
So, bad news guys for all pro audio community:
MADIface USB DOSEN'T WORK with Caldigit mini hub AT ALL!!!!!
It connects, shows Totalmix and RME settings, so far you could think all is good, but when you try to play some audio file in MacOS preview, Qlab, Wavelab or other app, the playback doesnt start: playing time doesnt run, there is no sound and no indication on Totalmix channels!!!
We have 2 MBPs - both has such result, High Sierra or Mojave - doesnt matter. Firmware - 24. Drivers tried- 3.14, 3.15, 3.15b1 - all the same story.
External USB drives, ethernet connections work fine with this dock, MADIface USB - is recognized, but doesnt work (tried both USB2 and USB3 ports)!
So, now we can work only 2 ways with MBP 2018 + RME MADIface USB:
1) on MacOS: using only internal minijack output (2 channels);
2) on Windows (Bootcamp): with buggy SCS (Show Cue Systems) software (using all RME interface outputs with no problems).
We need working chain of MBP+RME+Qlab!!!!!
Apple, please DO SOMETHING FINALLY! We are waiting 8(!!!) months for now!!!! The audio Pros cant work with your actual "Pro" machines!!!
Have you tried another RME interface that is known to work eg MADIface Pro?
Or another Caldigit in case it’s defective?
Or a y-cable in case a single port isn’t providing enough power? My guess is this is the issue.
I’m sure RME we’ll be able to test the MADIface USB on their own system soon.
That sounds like the issue that we fixed with driver 3.14 for the UFX. Let's check the MF USB again.
1) I'll test RME UFX tomorrow. No other interfaces are available for now.
2) Trying another Caldigit is not possible without buying it (140Eur) because there is no Caldigit interfaces in our country's stores and also no Caldigit dealers in our small country. We have to order it from other EU country.
3) RME MADIface needs 2W of power (info from manual), Caldigit's USB2 provides 2.5W, USB3 - 5W of power. So, power seems to be ok, but I'll try to find also y-cable.
Issue with MF USB confirmed. Working on it...
Thank you, Matthias! Now I have a hope!
Update: still working on it. Looks like this issue is isolated to the MADIface USB, and only shows up in combination with the Asmedia USB chip. Our USB bus analyzer gave us an idea that we are currently examining. Stay tuned.
We released new firmwares for the MADIface USB (25) and some others that fix this problem.
https://archiv.rme-audio.de/download/fu … ce_mac.zip
We tested our MF USB conjunction with Caldigit with new firmware (25) for 3 hours non-stop playing audio - all working, no bit crushed sounds, no drop outs!
Thank you very much, Matthias for quick response and great support!
Finally we can work with MBP 2018!
Driver 3.15 is now officially relased (including TotalMix FX 1.6). Also all flash updates (for the Asmedia issue) are available online.
Driver 3.15 is now officially relased (including TotalMix FX 1.6). Also all flash updates (for the Asmedia issue) are available online.
Thanks MC. Have you noticed an improvement in OS X performance since Apple released supplemental updates to 10.14.3?
I just heard a glitch through the ADI 2-Pro FS after an hour of playback via the Apple USB-C->A adapter so no change at our end.
In other news, we have tested the MADIface Pro with the HDMI CalDigit hub and USB 2.0 doesn't provide enough current for the device to power up.
The USB 3 port provides enough power for playback, but not phantom power on the mic inputs.
A Y-cable using both ports provided enough power for 48v.
The original Babyface only works with our Y-cable, even if it's only plugged into the USB 3 port. Conventional USB cables don't seem to work at all.
I wouldn't trust any of these options without an external PSU for critical use.
Well after a nightmare of a gig a couple of weeks ago where I had to physically unplug/replug my soundcard throughout the whole day(s) of rehearsal, I went in and see the people at the Apple Store. They created an RTA (some kind of escalated engineering report) and they got back to me with some tools and instructions on creating logs of the problem.
I've gone and made examples/logs of each combination of gear I have (RME / MOTU | Logic / Live / Max / Reaper | Input / Output / Input+Output).
Can also force it happening super consistently by disabling/enabling the "set date and time automatically" flag in System Preferences.
The good news is that the RME (3.1.5) behaves SO much nicer than my MOTU. The MOTU (as you can see in the vid below) fails catastrophically. The RME makes a little beep, or in the case of RME + Reaper just interrupts the audio momentarily.
Check out this disgusting shit:
http://rodrigoconstanzo.com/bucket/motu_noise.mp4
Hopefully this gets them closer to fixing things. Or at least, more people submitting reports like this.
Where is the like button? (Sorry, couldn't resist).
Driver 3.15 is now officially relased (including TotalMix FX 1.6). Also all flash updates (for the Asmedia issue) are available online.
Thanks again for the announcement. The 3.15 Readme says:
"New option in the Settings dialog to change between a smaller Safety Offset (3.x driver) and a bigger offset (as in the former 2.x driver. Useful for 2018 Macs with TB to USB adapters)."
Is there an advantage to using the smaller safety offset? As in, why did you retain this setting alongside the bigger offset?
cyrano wrote:When the USB 2 specs were still up, the spec read "minimum 500 mA".
http://www.rme-audio.de/en/products/babyface_pro.php
Under the general specifications in the above link it says 600mA - not disputing that at some point in time they may have said 500mA.
I was talking about the specs from the USB Consortium, not RME...
MC wrote:Driver 3.15 is now officially relased (including TotalMix FX 1.6). Also all flash updates (for the Asmedia issue) are available online.
Thanks again for the announcement. The 3.15 Readme says:
"New option in the Settings dialog to change between a smaller Safety Offset (3.x driver) and a bigger offset (as in the former 2.x driver. Useful for 2018 Macs with TB to USB adapters)."
Is there an advantage to using the smaller safety offset? As in, why did you retain this setting alongside the bigger offset?
Obviopusly the latency (roundtrip time) is a few samples shorter. Thanks to our competition's unrealistic marketing we are forced to offer a value as short as possible, which - as witnessed here - will not work reliable in many occasions, just a few. So it was time to make it switchable.
mjfe87 wrote:MC wrote:Driver 3.15 is now officially relased (including TotalMix FX 1.6). Also all flash updates (for the Asmedia issue) are available online.
Thanks again for the announcement. The 3.15 Readme says:
"New option in the Settings dialog to change between a smaller Safety Offset (3.x driver) and a bigger offset (as in the former 2.x driver. Useful for 2018 Macs with TB to USB adapters)."
Is there an advantage to using the smaller safety offset? As in, why did you retain this setting alongside the bigger offset?
Obviopusly the latency (roundtrip time) is a few samples shorter. Thanks to our competition's unrealistic marketing we are forced to offer a value as short as possible, which - as witnessed here - will not work reliable in many occasions, just a few. So it was time to make it switchable.
Ok thanks. Presumably this only affects recording latency, not the TotalMix round trip?
It affects both recording and playback. TM FX stays unchanged.
Apple has made macOS Mojave 10.14.4 beta 5 available for developers. I quote:
------------
...the most recent macOS Mojave developer seed contains changes that improve the reliability of USB audio devices.
------------
We will be testing this version over the weekend.
wow sounds promising
Very promising indeed!
Apple has made macOS Mojave 10.14.4 beta 5 available for developers. I quote:
------------
...the most recent macOS Mojave developer seed contains changes that improve the reliability of USB audio devices.
------------We will be testing this version over the weekend.
Eagerly awaiting results!!
I didn't find this on the web. Are these notes inside the installation files?
RME User Forum → FireWire & USB series → What's the verdict on current Macbook Pros + USB RME interfaces?
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